Anti-rush plugin for our pr and VI server.

[S?o?i???WEED] Wanted · Mar 12, 2013

Insomniac;79280 said:

I can think of many reasons not to implement any of the above penalties for rushing:

1] Delayers
a) If someone is idling at the back, or in the SR, getting caught up by SI because he's idle, the whole team suffers. In this case it's ultimately better to let him die for making the rest of the team wait.
b) If someone is farming at the back, forcing everyone to go back to the farmer will just be encouraging people to farm with him.

In the above 2 cases, would it be better to keep the team together or let the people who deserve to be left for dead be left to die?
Pretty clear answer, for all those with no guilty conscience about farming.

2] Versus complications
a) While there are occasions where moving back to help stragglers may benefit, there are as many occasions where having the rest of the team move forward while others "bait" the SI are even more beneficial to the team score.
b) Survivors caught in choke points (e.g.: Crossing of log in Cold Stream 1, Running over roofs in Dark Carnival 4) will usually be stuck there for a duration, due to the nature of the map and the inherent advantage given to SI: forcing players to port back to save fallen survivors would amplify the existing impediments to survivor progress.
c) Points of No Return - a survivor who is downed when the rest of the team has moved on past the point of no return is effectively dead [with the exception of incapacitated survivors capable of crawling]. He is, by original intention of the game developers, meant to be dead. Forcing survivors to return to that location would be a contrived way of giving them a second chance they should not have. This particular segment { c) } is largely my opinion, it does not have much practicality grounded behind it.

I would recommend alternative measures, of which one happens to be already established. The existing reputation system in place on EU and US PR Coop servers is a wonderful way of making people WANT to work together as a team. Penalties imposed on people who play selfishly; benefits given to people who play altruistically. This karma system really does reinforce the meaning of teamwork.

Perhaps the results of the above have not manifested themselves significantly; I would believe this to be due to the ease in obtaining an Excellent or Team Pillar status [When the system first came out, I went from Average to Team Pillar in no more than 8 hours, paying attention to my friendly fire.] To better reap the rewards of the system, I propose amplifying the impact on reputation from selfish playing styles as well as increasing the scope and impact of penalties on selfish players. This will STRONGLY discourage people from being individualistic.

My definition of selfish playing styles:
1) Team Killing
2) Rushing, relative to the rest of the team
3) Farming, relative to the rest of the team
To explain points 2) and 3), see below.

There is a fine line when distinguishing between players who are rushing and players who are holding up the game. Different people have different patience levels and different playing styles. Hence, players should analyze the situation they are in when playing with a particular group of people and react accordingly; they should conform to the situation.

I have seen groups of 16 players on Asia PR Coop move quickly TOGETHER through a map [i.e.: Dead Center complete in 17 minutes] despite having players of varying levels [from 10 to 200].

I have seen groups of 5-6 players idle in the same spot for 5 minutes, farming together, on the other Coop servers. (Got a demo recorded as proof, too.)

In either case, would you say that any of the players are causing harm to each other? Would you say that their playing style is selfish, seeing that they are merely following what each of them does? Could you even accuse them of rushing/farming? Grey areas abound.

I have brought up many points for discussion. Ultimately, the ability to change the way players play is determined by how the system is designed: there will be pros, there will be cons, and there will be limitations that come with the default coding of the game.

While I do sincerely appreciate the work that has been put into the community by the respective stakeholders, as well as not being exposed to the workings behind the scene, I do feel that the administrators of the server should come together and decide on a stand AS ONE regarding how much "rushing" or how much "farming" should be acceptable (or should be tolerated) and henceforth make clear and publicize this views to the community at large.

P.S.: The last paragraph is not to say that the administrators have not been doing anything of the sort; I do apologize if it does sound accusatory.
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Like i said it need some modification like you can't leave more than 3-4 players behind and it doesn't applies to bots already.This atleast control 1-2 players rushing ahead leaving 8 players behind.
2.farming is a problem in coop not in vs.

Insomniac · Mar 13, 2013

Yes, I understand the points you have put forth across. However, please do take reference from marvel's response that such a plugin would take up lots of server bandwidth.

I mentioned coop because people suggested bringing the plugin over to COOP servers. Thankfully, we both have the same opinion on the relevance of this plugin to Coop.

Otherwise, no offense meant to your idea. I still take the stand that a plugin wouldn't work on the PR config due to the various other reasons I mentioned pertaining to versus.

AzureKite · Mar 16, 2013

I totaly rejoin everyone who said it before, for VI : it's a very VERY BAD idea at all to put that system on.

Rushers are completely under control with regs and admins who play every days, and we explain to new players or beginners how strategy, fairplay and gaming work here. If they don't listen or are stubborn (that happens sometimes), we warn them first and try to make them think about the mistake they did (rush-alone-nonmain for ex.). If they keep doing it and screwing the team one round after, you can be sure the troublemaker guy will be kicked in 90% of case.

And I must say, it probably used to be a problem at some moment in the past of years, but since few month now, "rush-alone-noob-screwing-players" are less and less present and embarrassing. Probably because BigDaddy went in hollydays forever (rushing leader).

What I mean is that except some exception (champlar (lol), bompking, etc...) people mostly understand after 1 or 2 kick, and they don't do it again after. And that's really comfortable, because mentality is different from PR players and VI players for example, and on VI that's really pleasant to play with aware people, fair, and who are there for a good game with fun and budies, but without loosing the spirit of battle gaming !
Those last week I saw many beginners joining for the first time and saying some kind of speech like "That server is awesome i'll come back !" for example. And they do come back!

And all of this, it's a speciality and treasure of VI !

In my personnal example, I've played a a long time ago on ZombieGrill and ZombieIsland servers which are "close" to VI in gameplay speaking (but A WAY INFERIOR compared to our Divine-VI ). And the mind of people there is horrible, it's just insane. In those servers, nobody pays attention to nobody, and yes they could need an antirush system there lol

In final, that antirush system could be interresting for PR only, but depending of what they think about and need.
As I'm not a PR player, I'm absolutely not the one who could give opinion or advise for them, so I won't say anything.
Propers PR players know perfectly more the situation there, and what to think about.

But for VI, it's definitively NO !

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Anti-rush plugin for our pr and VI server.

[S?o?i???WEED] Wanted Guest

Insomniac Junior Member

AzureKite MG Donor